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Guest Darcy Callai Jr

What comes after 1.1 Full?

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Guest Katsushika Matsumoto

I don't think it's worth to talk about the future now, it's pretty much a moving target for us.. and the deadlines are firing at alarming rate here in KS. We've something pretty exciting coming up in the next 2 months.

I'm intrigued/curious what it could be :imbarazzato::thumbsup::!!:

Edited by Katsushika Matsumoto

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dido

My toughts are that it won't be good plan to release free "major" patches for nkp anymore. I really really like netkar and i think if we don't support the project, by support i mean - money, i guess then we won't see it at all in future. Perhaps a minor patches would be good to adress some issues, correct some things.

On Osella thing, i don't know what to think. Purely up to a KS, will they release it or not.

But overall, i would say it's time for developement team to move on to completely new incarnation of nkp, for which we'll pay them some money.

+1

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Guest NightShift

Dashboards? Someone did ask about a motion simulator plugin, and was told that BRD has the exclusive on that.

Yeah dashboards. There are several types, some have hardware dials, other rely on a little LCD display, down to those rev/shift indicators (now even the G27 comes with one)

ATM dashboards are vastly more affordable and accessible than motion sims to the average simracer who doesn't happen to have extremely deep pockets. Of course the same problems apply.

I wrote a reply but thought it was a bit repetitive (so didn't post it).

Well I hope there are no hard feelings :)

That's one of the interviews. The slightly disappointing revelation (it may have been in another article) was that there are no plans to pursue netBike, because the market's lacking input devices or something. It's really enjoyable just with a 360 controller, so anything else would be a bonus (as apposed to a necessity).

Meh personally I think netKar has still a long way to go, so IMO it's better KS keeps focused on it rather than pursuing other projects.

BTW I felt the most concerning bit of the interiew was this one:

From 2007 and on a lot of things have happened, among them the collaboration with Intel and Abarth in December 2008 who gave us the chance to start dealing with the issues of licensing.

Today the market of PC racing sims has substantially changed wrt just 3-4 years ago and it's showing the first symptoms - still hardly noticeable - of the downward spiral that hit the world of commercial flight simulation which, as of now, no longer is.

The phenomenon of modding has done a lot to increase the standards in PC simracing. Thanks to the early Simbin (works), even big publishers changed their attitude of releasing half-baked products relying on the lack of alternatives to their games. At the same time, now a publisher will hardly invest in an engine and licenses for the PC market. Who would invest millions in licensing if the day after release, a 15 yo "grabs" (sic) cars and official tracks for rFactor, GTR, etc?

The case involving Codemasters and the CTDP team which was working to the F1 2009 mod is revealing, even manufacturers are beginning to look to modding as to a problem to deal with.

In fact, in light of what has been said, KS today is developing software targeted at the automotive for professional applications, but is still a small reality born FOR simulation.

Our aim is to keep the good things we've done up to now which received praise and take the next step. The physics model and the simulational approach we've developed is regarded as sound in the simracing niche and during the last year a lot of casual gamers have discovered us and began to appreciate the approach of nKPro.

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Guest NightShift

That part is painting a doom & gloom scenario for simracing:

The parallel between simracing and flight simulation.

The prospect of a licensing crackdown round the corner.

The idea PC gaming might be dead already because of piracy/platform issues.

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Guest CAR
I'm intrigued/curious what it could be imbarazzato.gifthumbsup.gifrischio.gif

Hoepfully if an Italian finds it exciting, it has to be a Ferrari or Ducati bleh.gif

Yeah dashboards. There are several types, some have hardware dials, other rely on a little LCD display, down to those rev/shift indicators (now even the G27 comes with one)

I was gonna post this as an example (of what you might be talking about):

Well I hope there are no hard feelings :)

Of course not, it's just easy to become involved in a pointless argument online (where you both end up forgetting what you where originally arguing about).

Meh personally I think netKar has still a long way to go, so IMO it's better KS keeps focused on it rather than pursuing other projects.

Well netBike didn't go down particularly well when it first emerged (in fact one slightly humorous comment said what's next, netboat?), but bikers are a dedicated lot so it would generate a following, and the rest of us who like anything with wheels would also be interestedhappy204.gif

That part is painting a doom & gloom scenario for simracing:

The parallel between simracing and flight simulation.

The prospect of a licensing crackdown round the corner.

The idea PC gaming might be dead already because of piracy/platform issues.

It's a fair assessment of current trends, but it should be re-assuring that they've identified them (particularly if you're trying to do something different).

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Guest NightShift

I was gonna post this as an example (of what you might be talking about):

Yeah that's one thing. There are more:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anAKnaPKj5w

We know already nKp itself supports all kind of gadgets, but will BRD authorize a public release supporting all of that stuff? Last time I saw this discussed, Kunos replied with a definite no:

http://www.drivingitalia.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=46413&view=findpost&p=564519

Well netBike didn't go down particularly well when it first emerged (in fact one slightly humorous comment said what's next, netboat?), but bikers are a dedicated lot so it would generate a following, and the rest of us who like anything with wheels would also be interestedhappy204.gif

Especially because people were waiting for much needed nKp fixes :wink: Fixing 1.1 took quite a lot of time, first time 1.1b1 had been in the wild was August 2009, over 7 months.

Even if netBike shared the very same tracks and 97% codebase with netKar, I still can't see how they would manage to deliver consistent updates in a timely fashion. They are perpetually telling us they are too busy with other stuff (see Kunos' post from above)

It's a fair assessment of current trends, but it should be re-assuring that they've identified them (particularly if you're trying to do something different).

It would be reassuring if he also said how KS plans to get through this supposed 'simracing crunch'.

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Guest Xamir

Flight simming is quite another story, it's a much more niche product than sim racing. But why is flight simming dead for you? only because MS platform retired? The problem with MS is OS dependent, as their new policy changed from the retro compatible to the NEW "SVISTA" "nothing is compatible anymore" standard.

FS9 is still the best platform for most users and with so many add ons, there's no reason to change to FSX or to a newer one. I m still using FS9 and I wouldn't go FSX for all the compatibility problems with older add ons. For the same compatibility reason i can't eradicate "SVISTA" from my desktop pc for Win7, as most FS products I use won't work with it.

MS tried to make a tabula rasa so that everybody is forced to buy everything again, but this only turned into many pc still relying on WinXP. Another big problem is that every add on for MSFS is as expensive as a new racing game, so can you imagine what would mean to buy everything from the beginning to have all the eye candy airports and some liners at PMDG or Leonardo SH standards the every second year MS comes out with a new platform?

XPlane is still on the market, I own it, but it's good only for aerobatics, as visual flight in Europe is not so accurate and their avionic standard is quite primitive compared to what is avalaible for MSFS. FS community is still enjoying FS9 a lot. What FSX got more? Animals running wild here and there and cars on the street? Who's looking at these things while flying a liner? MS took a completely wrong way, they should have cooperated more with developers so that it would have been easier to replicate avionic systems and aircrafts performance. Instead they gave us some nice elephants to look at because part of the FS community is never flying: some take off their b737 from the "passenger view", prepare the landing briefing in the completely new and amazing 3D feature the "Virtual Toilette view" and while the autopilot is flying the approach and autolanding, they spot the AI A320 from the "Tower view" as it flares only 6 miles ahead of their autopiloted b737.

I ve been in the IVAO-IT staff for some time as ATC Coord, but then I had to disagree with the new "it's just a game" policy they pursued some years ago and left, been multiple times banned for making fun of them, so I know this community preety well...

Race simming hasn't the same problematics, it's instead something developing more and more. Just look at the top technologic iRacing or older simbin titles: laser scanned or satellite made tracks, more hardware horse power for deeper physic computing and so on. Race simming is much simpler than flight simming, the learning curve is much much smoother and to have fun you don't need to know what V1, Vr, V2, Vne, Vfe, Vmgc, IFR, IMC, VMC, CAVOK, EGT, FF, N1, TRQ LIRF 100420Z VRB02KT 3000 BR NSC 06/04 Q1021 NOSIG and so on mean. You just seat behind the steering and drive to your limit.

The only thing in common between Flight and Driving simulation is only the simulation word, but they are two very different universes.

Edited by Xamir

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Guest CAR

Yeah that's one thing. There are more

Oh yeah, I have seen them before.

We know already nKp itself supports all kind of gadgets, but will BRD authorize a public release supporting all of that stuff?

BRD don't seem to have it sussed themselves (but there probably is a perfectly good explanation for

).

It would be reassuring if he also said how KS plans to get through this supposed 'simracing crunch'.

Here's hoping that term doesn't catch onvomito.gif

Flight simming is quite another story, it's a much more niche product than sim racing.

You're talking to someone who's last experience was Knights of the Sky. These guys might be better to talk to.

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Guest NightShift

The only thing in common between Flight and Driving simulation is only the simulation word, but they are two very different universes.

I think they also have another couple thingies in common: they are both market niches that require dedication and specific equipment.

BTW most "sims" out there are not true sims. They don't even try to be, they just tack the term on the product to give a certain image. But most players are only interested in immersion rather than realism, and get themselves high by deluding themselves into thinking they would be able to handle a high performance car on a RL track.

And that's concerning because both Markus and Kunos have been saying for enough time already that we realism buffs are not nearly enough to pay the bills, that they should charge us at least as much as iRacing does. Kunos even said once that even the hardcore crowd lacks the skill/knowledge to tell what is realistic from is not (and I'm not saying he's wrong, but I'm still finding worrisome to think of the implications of this pov)

It is pretty much clear that there have been steps taken to make netKar more accessible (some would say "dumbed down"). And while I do recognize this is in general a good idea (sifting through the casual and arcade-sim players in the hope some will turn into full-fledged realism junkies), a lot depends on how this is handled.

E.g. I look at LFS and see how mouse driving, unrealistic views and all that game-y cruft that LFS offers has done to that community. Mind you I don't have anything against mouse drivers provided they switch to a wheel sooner or later, but the LFS experience shows most of them will learn their own warped ways to drive a car and are very wary of switching to a wheel, and it's easy to understand why: they put a lot of time into developing that 'technique', and with a wheel - they would have to start again from scratch.

nKp now supports driving with alternative views and controllers, what keeps it from following the same path?

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